gcseeker2002
12-12 10:40 AM
The following are various ways to express some one�s dissatisfaction/agony and draw some one else (Government/Media/Public) attention.
1. Daily Fasting : One or more people would sit for fasting from 6 AM to 6 PM. One group would pass on the fire to next group.
2. Continuous Fasting : One or more people would sit for fasting 24 hours a day. Such people should not have health issues like Blood Pressure, Gastric Trouble, Sugar, insulin deficiency, Heart relates issues. This may cuase arrest.
3. Protesting : Conduct a rally with group/mass of people with immigration ply cards and banners.
4. Wearing Black Ribbons : People would wear/put a small black ribbon on their shirt pockets (Upper left side of the chest) and attend duties. We can draw people attentions. Such ribbon should have white color immigration slogan printed on it.
5. Distributing Flyers : Distributing Flyers/Handouts to people in respective areas.
6. Banners : Display banner/show outs in the Traffic Island Medians
7. Flower Campaign : Sending Flowers to respective people, also called Gandhi giri.
8. Silent Sitting : Sitting in front of USCIS silently (no talk).
9. Silent sitting in front of Senators house: Group of people should sit (kind of protest) in front of respective state senators. We can draw maximum MEDIA attention.
10. Sweeping Roads : A group of people would sweep roads by wearing immigration slogans jackets.
11. Organize Blood Donate Drives : Interested member would donate blood (We should explain to media, why we are doing so).
12. Rally in All Major Cities : Conduct a rally in all Major cities (where we have at least 100 members) at the same time.
We still have various other ways to express our dissatisfaction, however, they are little rude and could cause more issues.
We should choose couple of ways from above to express our dissatisfaction. Members, feel free to add and delete from above list.
P.S: We need prior permission from local authorities
Looks like we have to some thing big at this Christmas season.
I am sure most of us here (especially from India) were pampered and did not even clean their own study desks or rooms of their house when they were young, now they are ready to sweep the roads of a foreign country to get the foreign government attention to get their gc :)
Humans, listen, life is not 1000 years, it is very short, dont waste the best part of your life waiting for gc.
1. Daily Fasting : One or more people would sit for fasting from 6 AM to 6 PM. One group would pass on the fire to next group.
2. Continuous Fasting : One or more people would sit for fasting 24 hours a day. Such people should not have health issues like Blood Pressure, Gastric Trouble, Sugar, insulin deficiency, Heart relates issues. This may cuase arrest.
3. Protesting : Conduct a rally with group/mass of people with immigration ply cards and banners.
4. Wearing Black Ribbons : People would wear/put a small black ribbon on their shirt pockets (Upper left side of the chest) and attend duties. We can draw people attentions. Such ribbon should have white color immigration slogan printed on it.
5. Distributing Flyers : Distributing Flyers/Handouts to people in respective areas.
6. Banners : Display banner/show outs in the Traffic Island Medians
7. Flower Campaign : Sending Flowers to respective people, also called Gandhi giri.
8. Silent Sitting : Sitting in front of USCIS silently (no talk).
9. Silent sitting in front of Senators house: Group of people should sit (kind of protest) in front of respective state senators. We can draw maximum MEDIA attention.
10. Sweeping Roads : A group of people would sweep roads by wearing immigration slogans jackets.
11. Organize Blood Donate Drives : Interested member would donate blood (We should explain to media, why we are doing so).
12. Rally in All Major Cities : Conduct a rally in all Major cities (where we have at least 100 members) at the same time.
We still have various other ways to express our dissatisfaction, however, they are little rude and could cause more issues.
We should choose couple of ways from above to express our dissatisfaction. Members, feel free to add and delete from above list.
P.S: We need prior permission from local authorities
Looks like we have to some thing big at this Christmas season.
I am sure most of us here (especially from India) were pampered and did not even clean their own study desks or rooms of their house when they were young, now they are ready to sweep the roads of a foreign country to get the foreign government attention to get their gc :)
Humans, listen, life is not 1000 years, it is very short, dont waste the best part of your life waiting for gc.
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bestofall
04-11 08:47 AM
Why you are posting the 2002 article to add confusion
eb_retrogession
02-24 09:35 AM
Dear friends,
As many of you are well aware, it has been about 50 days since IV was started. Since then, we have come a long way in setting up a platform to voice our concerns. We also established an able alliance with QGA to have a powerful channel for our voices to be heard on the hill.
It is now game time!!
Two very significant legislative vehicles, namely the PACE bill and Comprehensive immigration bill are right on the corner. PACE is scheduled for discussion end of Feb, and the comprehensive Immigration bill beginning of March. In this dynamic legislative climate, it if very difficult to predict which of these potential vehicles could bear fruit, or even predict the timeframes accurately. IV�s strategy is to pursue both the bills and push for our goals to be on them.
We are in immediate need of funds for that very purpose. We are seriously low on gas right now, for the journey ahead that we are only just starting on. We have only raised $30,000 in the last 50 days; even more alarming, fund raising has gone down drastically in the last 2 weeks. At our current burn rate, we will be out of money in a month or so, just when we expect the bills to come up for discussion on the Senate floors. As you can expect and appreciate, there is a cost for achieving anything politically. IV has already demonstrated a great deal of leadership and persistence to work on retrogression relief and labor backlog elimination. Many IV members will start making trips to DC in the coming weeks to meet lawmakers at the hill. We need your help NOW!
Members that have not yet contribute money, please do so TODAY! And members that have already contributed please consider another contribution. We need all hands on deck. Also pass on the message of the immediate need of funds to your friends.
If you have questions, as always, please send a note to info@immigrationvoice.org
As many of you are well aware, it has been about 50 days since IV was started. Since then, we have come a long way in setting up a platform to voice our concerns. We also established an able alliance with QGA to have a powerful channel for our voices to be heard on the hill.
It is now game time!!
Two very significant legislative vehicles, namely the PACE bill and Comprehensive immigration bill are right on the corner. PACE is scheduled for discussion end of Feb, and the comprehensive Immigration bill beginning of March. In this dynamic legislative climate, it if very difficult to predict which of these potential vehicles could bear fruit, or even predict the timeframes accurately. IV�s strategy is to pursue both the bills and push for our goals to be on them.
We are in immediate need of funds for that very purpose. We are seriously low on gas right now, for the journey ahead that we are only just starting on. We have only raised $30,000 in the last 50 days; even more alarming, fund raising has gone down drastically in the last 2 weeks. At our current burn rate, we will be out of money in a month or so, just when we expect the bills to come up for discussion on the Senate floors. As you can expect and appreciate, there is a cost for achieving anything politically. IV has already demonstrated a great deal of leadership and persistence to work on retrogression relief and labor backlog elimination. Many IV members will start making trips to DC in the coming weeks to meet lawmakers at the hill. We need your help NOW!
Members that have not yet contribute money, please do so TODAY! And members that have already contributed please consider another contribution. We need all hands on deck. Also pass on the message of the immediate need of funds to your friends.
If you have questions, as always, please send a note to info@immigrationvoice.org
2011 Artistic Graffiti - Graffiti
pmpforgc
10-10 09:24 PM
Friends
I filed My concurrent I-140 and I-485 in Schedule A Group-II , EB-2, Exceptional Ability in Arts and Sciences Application with USCIS recipt date of AUGUST 24, 2006 for both I-140 and I-485?
(1) My I-140 is yet not approved I had asked my attorney to do premium processing. In this new situation should I go for premium processing or hold it back as they will not process my I-485 due to un availability of numbers in Schedule A.
(2)With current retrogession in Schedule A in November visa bulletin What will happen to my I-140 and I-485 processing.
(3)If Schedule A categorey ends after 10/5/2005 as indicated in November visa bulletin what will happen to CASES like mine which were filed after that? does they get transfered to EB-2 ( or EB-3) with their filing dates, set as priority date?
(4) Does establishment of date of 10/5/2005 in NOVEMBER visa bulletin means that they will still process application that they accepted till this NOVEMBER-2006 .
Your experienced help is Gretaly appreciated in this developing situation.
I filed My concurrent I-140 and I-485 in Schedule A Group-II , EB-2, Exceptional Ability in Arts and Sciences Application with USCIS recipt date of AUGUST 24, 2006 for both I-140 and I-485?
(1) My I-140 is yet not approved I had asked my attorney to do premium processing. In this new situation should I go for premium processing or hold it back as they will not process my I-485 due to un availability of numbers in Schedule A.
(2)With current retrogession in Schedule A in November visa bulletin What will happen to my I-140 and I-485 processing.
(3)If Schedule A categorey ends after 10/5/2005 as indicated in November visa bulletin what will happen to CASES like mine which were filed after that? does they get transfered to EB-2 ( or EB-3) with their filing dates, set as priority date?
(4) Does establishment of date of 10/5/2005 in NOVEMBER visa bulletin means that they will still process application that they accepted till this NOVEMBER-2006 .
Your experienced help is Gretaly appreciated in this developing situation.
more...
brb2
10-10 07:01 PM
Well, DOS is alerting that don't expect additional rapid movement any time soon. Here is the relevant part of their warning:
E. EMPLOYMENT-BASED VISA AVAILABILITY IN THE COMING MONTHS
Cut-off date movements in recent months have been greater than might ordinarily be expected, in an effort to maximize number use within the annual numerical limits. This has been necessary because demand being received from Citizenship and Immigration Services (CIS) Offices for adjustment of status cases has been relatively light. As these dates have advanced, however, many thousands of applicants have become eligible for processing at CIS Offices. Once number use increases significantly as CIS addresses its backlog, cut-off date movement will necessarily slow or stop. Moreover, in some categories cut-off date retrogression is a particular possibility.
The only positive thing I can take from this visa bulletin (assuming there is even a modicum of linear thought possible on the movement of dates) is that the 485 traffic for PDs between 2002 July and Jan 2003 is fairly light for EB2 India. After all they stated as much in their footnotes about anticipated movement of PDs. This can be construed as offering some hope for those from EB2 India with priority dates in early 2003 (say up to march). After all anyone in their right mind would not chance CP now with the fluidity of priority dates and the pending BEC deluge of cases, and the hordes of people hunting labour subs. etc. Basically if anyone gets the chance to file 485 they will do it lest the dates retrogress again while they are waiting for the consular interview.
So those with early 2003 dates can be hopeful now, later than march and I doubt you will be in this fiscal years quota.
Very true about the nurses and PTs. This will definitely lead to a lot of noise and I am quite sure the remaining 50K visas left for recapture for yrs 2002-2004 will also be recaptured soon after the elections. I hope for the SKIL provisions but am less confident about them than I am about the Schedule A workers.
E. EMPLOYMENT-BASED VISA AVAILABILITY IN THE COMING MONTHS
Cut-off date movements in recent months have been greater than might ordinarily be expected, in an effort to maximize number use within the annual numerical limits. This has been necessary because demand being received from Citizenship and Immigration Services (CIS) Offices for adjustment of status cases has been relatively light. As these dates have advanced, however, many thousands of applicants have become eligible for processing at CIS Offices. Once number use increases significantly as CIS addresses its backlog, cut-off date movement will necessarily slow or stop. Moreover, in some categories cut-off date retrogression is a particular possibility.
The only positive thing I can take from this visa bulletin (assuming there is even a modicum of linear thought possible on the movement of dates) is that the 485 traffic for PDs between 2002 July and Jan 2003 is fairly light for EB2 India. After all they stated as much in their footnotes about anticipated movement of PDs. This can be construed as offering some hope for those from EB2 India with priority dates in early 2003 (say up to march). After all anyone in their right mind would not chance CP now with the fluidity of priority dates and the pending BEC deluge of cases, and the hordes of people hunting labour subs. etc. Basically if anyone gets the chance to file 485 they will do it lest the dates retrogress again while they are waiting for the consular interview.
So those with early 2003 dates can be hopeful now, later than march and I doubt you will be in this fiscal years quota.
Very true about the nurses and PTs. This will definitely lead to a lot of noise and I am quite sure the remaining 50K visas left for recapture for yrs 2002-2004 will also be recaptured soon after the elections. I hope for the SKIL provisions but am less confident about them than I am about the Schedule A workers.
Macaca
04-13 01:33 PM
Some paras from U-Va. Receives Largest Gift in School History (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/12/AR2007041202270.html), Friday, April 13, 2007
The University of Virginia announced its largest gift ever yesterday, a $100 million donation that will enable the state's flagship university to establish a school of leadership and public policy.
The gift is from Frank Batten Sr., a 1950 graduate and retired chairman and chief executive of the media company Landmark Communications Inc., who had already donated $60 million to the business school.
The University of Virginia announced its largest gift ever yesterday, a $100 million donation that will enable the state's flagship university to establish a school of leadership and public policy.
The gift is from Frank Batten Sr., a 1950 graduate and retired chairman and chief executive of the media company Landmark Communications Inc., who had already donated $60 million to the business school.
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ssss
08-18 12:40 PM
I have paper filed at NSC on June 11th, with a RD June12th.
No approval yet. My AP was approved long back
No approval yet. My AP was approved long back
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nb_des
06-18 02:41 PM
She will continue on H4 status until she uses EAD (by filing I-9 with an employer when she starts working). At that point, her H4 is automatically invalid and she is then on EAD. Until then she can be on H4. Same rule applies to H1.
Thanks this is useful information. Also I am planning to continue in my H1 status as per company policy they allow EAD/AP only for spouse and not the employee. In future, will I be able to file EAD/AP for myself separately or does this need to be done with 485 filing? In future if I decide to file EAD/AP can I do this myself or would I need my employer for this?
Thanks this is useful information. Also I am planning to continue in my H1 status as per company policy they allow EAD/AP only for spouse and not the employee. In future, will I be able to file EAD/AP for myself separately or does this need to be done with 485 filing? In future if I decide to file EAD/AP can I do this myself or would I need my employer for this?
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somegchuh
10-19 12:44 PM
Tell me about it. My wife didn't have a fancy law degree but she had a decent job before we got married and she came to US. She doesn't have any specific skills that will qualify her H1b but she has a MBA. So there isn't much she can do in terms of furthering her education. So she's been stuck at home for the last 4 years.
I have been now for 7 years and still waiting... my wife who graudated law with top honors in a top university in india and was pracicing with a leading corporate law firm joined me in US and to make it good we spent around $65K on her law school graduation here and then another 15K on bar exams preparations for NY and CA. She managed to pull through all this. we decided to have a baby and take care of her wihtout day care the 1st 2years. now my wife sits home since she cannot file a H1 though there are willing employers becuase she has stayed here for 6 years on h4 and my llabor filed 2001 was still in BEC.... what can i do... i left a Director job in fortune 50 company and joined as consultant so that i can make use of a pre-approved labor, then another regression happend and i am still waiting to file 485. I just want to let my wife to work for a couple of year and make use of the effort she spent in her US law school and bar exams and want to return back to India.... but when can i get that 2 years.....
I have been now for 7 years and still waiting... my wife who graudated law with top honors in a top university in india and was pracicing with a leading corporate law firm joined me in US and to make it good we spent around $65K on her law school graduation here and then another 15K on bar exams preparations for NY and CA. She managed to pull through all this. we decided to have a baby and take care of her wihtout day care the 1st 2years. now my wife sits home since she cannot file a H1 though there are willing employers becuase she has stayed here for 6 years on h4 and my llabor filed 2001 was still in BEC.... what can i do... i left a Director job in fortune 50 company and joined as consultant so that i can make use of a pre-approved labor, then another regression happend and i am still waiting to file 485. I just want to let my wife to work for a couple of year and make use of the effort she spent in her US law school and bar exams and want to return back to India.... but when can i get that 2 years.....
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vikramy
12-30 01:17 AM
This Russian guy is a Crazy, Sick, Day dreamer
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willgetgc2005
11-09 10:49 AM
AC360, CNN
John King, CNN happened to mention yesterday on AC360, that CIR can be passed in the blink of an eye. He seems to think it is the easiest thing to do for the president and the Dems in the current situation.
Any thoughts ?
John King, CNN happened to mention yesterday on AC360, that CIR can be passed in the blink of an eye. He seems to think it is the easiest thing to do for the president and the Dems in the current situation.
Any thoughts ?
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desi3933
02-11 03:34 PM
Looking at the Labor cert , it says "Masters degree" and NOT "Masters or equivalent". that might be the caused the I140 denial .
Any one had this situation before ?
Thanks
-vinod
I have sent you PM.
It seems that your I-140 is re-evaluated and denied.
___________________
Not a legal advice.
Any one had this situation before ?
Thanks
-vinod
I have sent you PM.
It seems that your I-140 is re-evaluated and denied.
___________________
Not a legal advice.
more...
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stuckinmuck
05-14 12:26 PM
chandrajp, many times it's not because of rules. It is common courtesy to go to a cafeteria if one is available. Smell of Indian food in general (it's a fact not criticism) may have a distracting effect in a work location so it should be eaten in a cafeteria (if available). Also, we need not emulate other people's lack of courtesy and do the same thing (like some people quoted Americans eating burgers in their cube). If we have the option, we should eat in the appropriate location.
In addition, with respect to discrimination, I do not condone it at all but we need to do a reality check for ourselves as well. I have never worked in India since I left the country 10 years ago but my friends working in India have told me how their managers have humiliated them by speaking in a regional language in meetings that they didn't know. So wherever there is a difference of culture, language etc., unfortunately human beings tend to behave the same i.e. discriminate against others who are different from them. For example, how do we explain the 'Fair & Lovely' ads? It's blatant discrimination based on skin colour.
Discrimination should be done away from every aspect of life.
In addition, with respect to discrimination, I do not condone it at all but we need to do a reality check for ourselves as well. I have never worked in India since I left the country 10 years ago but my friends working in India have told me how their managers have humiliated them by speaking in a regional language in meetings that they didn't know. So wherever there is a difference of culture, language etc., unfortunately human beings tend to behave the same i.e. discriminate against others who are different from them. For example, how do we explain the 'Fair & Lovely' ads? It's blatant discrimination based on skin colour.
Discrimination should be done away from every aspect of life.
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malibuguy007
04-01 09:03 PM
I haven't applied for green card yet. Is IV only for GC purposes or it addresses other issues too which makes life of H1b holder hell?
Not sure why you would generalize all H1b holders as experiencing hell - I for one did not. Anyways if you take the time to browse the forums you will find the answer to your question.
Not sure why you would generalize all H1b holders as experiencing hell - I for one did not. Anyways if you take the time to browse the forums you will find the answer to your question.
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virtual55
03-02 11:13 AM
I am working with an Indian Organization and asking them to send a mass mail to all its members and also asking them to contribute money to IV.
I request all members of IV who are members of any Indian Organizations to do the same.
I request all members of IV who are members of any Indian Organizations to do the same.
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wellwishergc
04-03 11:12 AM
bheemi,
I am shocked at your statement after seeing such an organized effort from IV. The only conclusion that I could make is - you are sympathetic to the 'anti-immigrant sentiments' and are out here to create trouble.
Anyways, instead of criticizing someone, please let us know what you have done for the cause.
I am suprprised if IV is working towards abiltiy to file 485 and hard country limit...Just want to know how IV is working towards these 2 items...
If any of these two wont show out in coming bill,..then I would say goodbye to IV..because all other items in bill were there without IV;s interaction....
Can somebody calrify if these options will anyway include in this bill..by means of ammendements...
I am shocked at your statement after seeing such an organized effort from IV. The only conclusion that I could make is - you are sympathetic to the 'anti-immigrant sentiments' and are out here to create trouble.
Anyways, instead of criticizing someone, please let us know what you have done for the cause.
I am suprprised if IV is working towards abiltiy to file 485 and hard country limit...Just want to know how IV is working towards these 2 items...
If any of these two wont show out in coming bill,..then I would say goodbye to IV..because all other items in bill were there without IV;s interaction....
Can somebody calrify if these options will anyway include in this bill..by means of ammendements...
more...
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doknek
05-10 09:26 AM
Try Tri Valley
I hope you guys didn't try Tri-Valley Univ. President indicted of visa fraud Bay Area university president indicted for student visa fraud scheme (http://www.ice.gov/news/releases/1105/110502oakland.htm)
I hope you guys didn't try Tri-Valley Univ. President indicted of visa fraud Bay Area university president indicted for student visa fraud scheme (http://www.ice.gov/news/releases/1105/110502oakland.htm)
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santb1975
12-16 11:49 AM
you can definately contribute less than 50$. Just login to paypal and send your contribution to donations at immigrationvoice.org and better yet team up with your colleagues and if 10 of you can contribute 10$ each that becomes a 100. We have had a few IV'ans do that.
Please remember IV is made up of people like you and me and IV will become what we want it to be. IV cannot function without contibutions from members like you and me as well. Every member in IV (including the Core team) has a Job, Career and a family. some IV'ans contribute money, some contribute time, some contribute both time and money and some do none. It is all about priorities.:)
Hello there,
I have been wanting to make an IV contribution for a long time and here is my problem..I probably can be labeled a miseror a magpie! ..Whenever I go to the IV link to contribute and see the $50 or $100 option I panic and get out..yes I do!
I have some desi colleagues and was discussing this issue with them at work..and they had the exact same experience..wow..I am not the only magpie..
But hey is'nt IV the one which is at the receiving end not getting our contributions..
I speak from my own experience and call me a mapie or a miser..or whatever..I cant make myself make a $50 or more contribution .. thats the way I am..But I can sure make a smaller contribution (like a monthly recurring $10 contribution which really is easier to make) and I am quite sure IV will benefit from my small contributions as well as i think a lot more people will not hesitate making contributions in smaller denominations than a whopper $50+
And really this is not related to IV effort but more to do with my own way of thinking about parting with my money..I love my money..:)...
My history - Made $0 contributions so far..and have been wanting to contribute for a long time now..but keep backing away..
Please remember IV is made up of people like you and me and IV will become what we want it to be. IV cannot function without contibutions from members like you and me as well. Every member in IV (including the Core team) has a Job, Career and a family. some IV'ans contribute money, some contribute time, some contribute both time and money and some do none. It is all about priorities.:)
Hello there,
I have been wanting to make an IV contribution for a long time and here is my problem..I probably can be labeled a miseror a magpie! ..Whenever I go to the IV link to contribute and see the $50 or $100 option I panic and get out..yes I do!
I have some desi colleagues and was discussing this issue with them at work..and they had the exact same experience..wow..I am not the only magpie..
But hey is'nt IV the one which is at the receiving end not getting our contributions..
I speak from my own experience and call me a mapie or a miser..or whatever..I cant make myself make a $50 or more contribution .. thats the way I am..But I can sure make a smaller contribution (like a monthly recurring $10 contribution which really is easier to make) and I am quite sure IV will benefit from my small contributions as well as i think a lot more people will not hesitate making contributions in smaller denominations than a whopper $50+
And really this is not related to IV effort but more to do with my own way of thinking about parting with my money..I love my money..:)...
My history - Made $0 contributions so far..and have been wanting to contribute for a long time now..but keep backing away..
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Jaime
09-22 10:44 PM
Hi gsc999.. It was nice talking to you in DC..
The reason I suggested sending in our credentials is beacuse the key in reverse brain drain is also "brain" along with "drain".
If we send in our credentials wrapped along with a stopper it will show them what they are going to loose.
Even to hard core right wingers it will show them that even if they neglect the human factor they cannot neglect the intellectual factor..
Definitely! Totally sets us apart from illegals. (And a few people have asked me why I "bash" illegals. I really do not. They have their cause and we respect them like we should respect every other human being. We simply should not be lumped in with their cause, because we are opposites, and because that has been what has affected us so much)
We need to finally break the chains and differentiate ourselves from illegals. If the government won't give us our rightful place as respected legals, we need to go take that place, because it's ours! Otherwise we will continue to be bullied by Loo Dobbs and company, and we will continue to be victimized by the apathy and politicking of Congress!!!
The reason I suggested sending in our credentials is beacuse the key in reverse brain drain is also "brain" along with "drain".
If we send in our credentials wrapped along with a stopper it will show them what they are going to loose.
Even to hard core right wingers it will show them that even if they neglect the human factor they cannot neglect the intellectual factor..
Definitely! Totally sets us apart from illegals. (And a few people have asked me why I "bash" illegals. I really do not. They have their cause and we respect them like we should respect every other human being. We simply should not be lumped in with their cause, because we are opposites, and because that has been what has affected us so much)
We need to finally break the chains and differentiate ourselves from illegals. If the government won't give us our rightful place as respected legals, we need to go take that place, because it's ours! Otherwise we will continue to be bullied by Loo Dobbs and company, and we will continue to be victimized by the apathy and politicking of Congress!!!
vjkypally
10-05 10:24 AM
Thats great news
smuggymba
01-01 09:20 PM
He called it garbage can out of bitterness and perhaps a little sarcasm. Obviously this is very important to him, otherwise he wouldn't have vented to perfect strangers on the internet. Have you never really wanted something and lashed out at it out of frustration?
I understand and respect the feelings of people in similar situation.
I understand and respect the feelings of people in similar situation.
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